Ok. Let me mess a little here.
written by Honey , February 20, 2007

1. Blood banks do not take blood donated by immigrants unless they have been around for at least 3 years.
I am a Kenyan negro, but I support that measure. It helps stop spread of microbes from one geographical zone to another. Malarial parasites take quite a while to dissapear from the system.
To 'mascularize' that point, also note that most vaccines are a thing of the past in America, since they beleive they have successfully eradicated some diseases that still roam free in poor places. However, the surge of Tuberculosis cases in recent years has the health officers scratching heads.
Ailments like Chagas' disease show up today in America, while 5 deacdes ago, it was limited to latin America or the poor western countries (because its spread corresponds with the level of poverty- since poor living structures harbor the disease vectors that shoot these parasites in blood streams. It takes 30 years for this disease to physically manifest itself)
A year ago we were talking of the 'American disaster waiting to happen'. Kids are no longer vaccinated. if one day some naughty virus decides to show up, it will be a mess.
Look at some rare skin cancers like Karposis Sarcoma that were around in the 60's, currently showing up in AIDS patients. i.e those whose immune system is compromised.

2. I support Mbeki, and I support Mbeki not.
I support him because I beleive that while HIV may truly exist, and leads to the AIDS condition, it may also be be used as a political weapon to put down some zones.
We all know some of the test kits in Africa are not state-of-the-art. We also know, most people, even those who are simply starving are being passed for AIDS cases.
I heard by rumor, that Beijing told off WHO when it wanted to tabulate its AIDS data, and it has been helpful.

By the way, at times dont we flag this race card too much!

In very few words: Not everything is as seems.

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written by Amir Ibrahim , February 21, 2007

Poorly written article. Sod it!! But why the low standards Eichener, Opotis? ectopic? The cause that ........ the ground that......slipppage??!!

What is the hmmmmm ....for. Style up peoples!!

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written by aeichener , February 21, 2007

'Amir Ibrahîm:

1. The article has nevertheless sparked good answers.

2. I think that Bosibori can write better; much better indeed, for she has already proven it. I had published her brief article, because the topic itself is worth it, and because we have too few articles dealing with matters of science and medicine, so I want to encourage the thematic spread.

But you are invited to deepen and strengthen your article, BB. I constantly strive to polish my own contributions, so you might just wish to try the same.

Alexander

Thanks !
written by Bosibori , February 21, 2007

well thanks guys for the constructive criticsm...I am working on being a better writer,geez! some of you can be real blunt !

Honey- my daughter was born in America she gets immunized she still has a couple more to go...or was that a figure of speech...and what did you mean by the China issue on Aids statistics.
The Thabo Mbeki question still leaves alot to be answered,considering he was in his country,though he has been caught in a web of controversies about the HIV virus though there is really no proof that it causes AIDS.

well ?
written by Bosibori , February 21, 2007

Thats Alexander
is that not the same thing Dr.Horowitz preaches...and well though i know you have your reservations about Dr.Horowitz could there not be some truth to it .Why is it that the largest HIV/AIDS issues are among Aficans and African Americans...Do you side with the wikipedia view ?

Vaccinations
written by Honey , February 22, 2007

In my state, it is a parents choice to have their child receive it. I know kids who have grown up, mostly american without a number of shots. My memory fades, but a while ago, I knew a good number that were not forced on parents. However, the medical officers must make the parent aware.

Incase an immigrant shows up and has something, they are immeadiately allocated a case worker to follow thru with medication. Failure to do so is against the law.

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written by Honey , February 22, 2007

BB, I said 'most', although I must check which vaccines are made today. Actually the US no longer looks at producing vaccines as a worthy cause. It is economically draining in terms of research. Your daughter might be getting those that have been kept around. They dont produce them anymore. If they need them, they import them.

what ?
written by Bosibori , February 22, 2007

Oh my Gosh honey !
if what you say is true,thats very scary ! though i know they have most them combined into six vaccines in one shot(i will do my research though)

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written by emmo opoti , February 22, 2007

There's another weird story here about HIV and an African Head of State, Gambian President's bitter medicine.

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written by aeichener , February 22, 2007

One rather perceptive remark about the etiology of conspiracy infections among black people I have found in Wikipedia; in the Thabo Mbeki article:

"Additionally, his views dovetailed with some broader themes in African politics. Many Africans find it suspicious that black Africans bear the largest share of the AIDS burden, and that the drugs to treat it are expensive and sold mainly by Western pharmaceutical companies. The history of malicious and manipulative health policies of the colonial and apartheid governments in Africa, including biological warfare programs set up by the apartheid state, also help to fuel views that the scientific discourse of AIDS might be a tool for European and American political, cultural or economic agendas."

Wikipedia on Thabo Mbeki's AIDS controversies

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written by aeichener , February 22, 2007

And while we care with Thabo "the evil clown" Mbeki (*sigh*), here is an excerpt from a remarkable article in the Guardian:

If you think the nutritionists and vitamin peddlers in the UK are weird, you really want to go to South Africa, where President Thabo Mbeki has a long history of siding with the HIV denialists, who believe that HIV does not cause Aids (but that treatments for it do), and where his health minister talks up fruit and vegetables as a treatment, as we have previously covered here.
In this world, which is not as remote as you might think from where you're sat, Zackie Achmat is a hero: the founder of the Treatment Action Campaign in South Africa, he recently won a breakthrough in his long battle against the vitamin-loving Aids denialists of Mbeki's government, to make HIV medication available through the public health system.

Achmat is also HIV positive, and was wealthy enough to afford antiretroviral medication, but deprived himself, risking his own life, as a matter of principle, until they were made widely available, despite even the personal pleas of Nelson Mandela, an avowed and public supporter of both antiretroviral medication and Achmat's work.

Source:

More background information,which I recommend to you

"But we have done things so badly here, we are such a good example of how not to deal with the epidemic, that we offer a valuable lesson to the world, a lesson that all governments ought to study. The great lesson for how not to do things is here." Once that has been done, Achmat recommends studying Brazil, the developing country where the disease has been dealt with most admirably. South Africa and Brazil are similar in many ways: the two countries exhibit a vast inequality between rich and poor, they are similarly affluent and dynamic compared to their neighbours and, in the early Nineties, were at almost exactly the same level in terms of incidence of Aids. He produces a chart showing the incidence of death per every 100,000 women aged 15 to 64 in Brazil, and one for the same group in South Africa. The Brazilian curve is as one would expect it to be: slowly ascending then becoming steeper after the age group hits 50. The South African curve is as high at peak child-bearing age, 20 to 35, as it is at 60.

Overall, the number of men and women dying in the 30 to 34 age group in South Africa is higher than any other. "We've done everything wrong and Brazil has done everything right," said Achmat, "from setting a clear example at leadership level, to combining prevention with treatment, to investing the necessary money, to displaying, as a society, a healthy attitude towards sex. What I mean is that Brazil does not have an inferiority complex about the fact that its people are having lots of sex. Unlike South Africa, where there is also lots of sex going on, but you see this hypocrisy and denial right from the top."

He calls this attitude "public piety and private permissiveness", whereas in Brazil, he said, permissiveness is both private and public. The risk of Aids is greater, he believes, in those countries where there is sexual licence, but no sexual freedom; where it is taboo to talk about sex, but women are treated abominably.

Alexander

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written by aeichener , February 22, 2007

Well, it's racial profiling. Sure. But the question behind it is whether racial profiling can at all be considered a good thing (and if ever so, when?!). Take the example of police preferably stopping young black drivers at night (criminal suspicion: "WB"= "riving while black", a common offence). It is racist, and angering; but it is also efficient and *does* lead to a higher success quota of apprehending wrongdoers than a colour-blind approach. But does that already make it licit?

See the following challenging article in the LGBT "Advocate":

oh no !
written by Bosibori , February 22, 2007

Emmo that story is just absurd ! How does he get away misleading people like that ,a whole President ?

AIDS and Africa
written by Nekessa , February 22, 2007

I am not a conspiracy theorist. However, in my opinion there are certain practices in our society currently that would attribute to the abnormal increase in the spread of HIV/AIDS.
1.Lack in decisive leadership-- both secular and religious leaders. It is irresponsible to advocate abstinence and/or disuse of condoms since we know that for most people this is impractical. In this respect,
2.Assuming that the West is responsible for the spread of HIV/AIDS, one must also acknowledge movement of humans, thus interracial sex. In Minnesota, where there is a large African immigrant community, healthworkers, when testing for STDs, always ask if one has been with an African since these communities have the highest infection rates. Incidentally, Minnesota is also home to one of the highest numbers of interracial dating in the US. So how does this play into the conspiracy?
On the conspiracy-- The Tuskegee Experiment in the US was responsible for the infection and eventual death from syphillis, of hundreds of black men.

Tracking the Real Genocide Here, a discussion on conspirancy or not, worth a read.

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written by Healthcare Worker in Mnh , February 22, 2007

I tend to keep off from discussing AIDS as a racist affair because I think that this is one lens of looking at it. The AIDS issue in the black community all over the world equates issues of racism all over the world. Some effects are self inflicted while some are institutionalized or cultural and depending on how one wants to see it the discussion can be unending and unnerving. I am at a point where I believe that maybe it is time black people all over the world stopped blaming the western world and did somethings for themselves ( indeed some are already doing it) it however requires a concerted and deliberate action. This is because the western civilization is hegemonic and will not cease to take this form just because Africans are dying of HIV/AIDS. Thus I wonder how we can equate the following behaviors to western control: brothers on the down low infecting sisters "knowingly" or the whole issue of children or virgins being raped as a way of cleansing HIV/AIDS? Indeed the western world has some blame on what we grapple with but there has to be point where we can take responsibility and correct some on going deeds that might spread HIV/AIDS.

Notably, this disease seems to be prone in black populations. In the US where blacks form 2% of the population 50% suffer from his disease. Similarly, the figures are also high in the black immigrant community in the Twin Cities (Minneapolis and St. Paul). Above all the sub-Saharan Africa has been leading prior to the recent outbreak in India. This begs the following question. Does this have anything to depict black people's sexuality? I do not know, again this remains a sore area when discussing HIV/AIDS. Admittedly, research shows that most of the cases are due to heterosexual relationships. Thus, I have continued to wonder why the ABC model and especially the use of the condom produced positive results in Uganda and saw the raise in the the cases when the C was taken away.

Nonetheless, I buy into the theory that the virus was a making of the western world. Evidence of this is in the varying types (strain) of the same disease that are found all over the black communities of the world. Additionally, the discussion that ensued after the anti-retovirals were discovered clearly showed that capitalistic pharmaceutical valued the bottom line than African lives.

With this said, I must admit that I love to read what different people chime into the discourse and prefer to keep it this way. There is definitely a lot to learn from this website and it is a great way of gleaning views.

:roll:

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written by honey , February 22, 2007

Nothing scary BB. The vaccines kept are as viable as any other.

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written by Dave Nyambati , February 22, 2007

I'm a regular blood donor here in the US and part of what you say is true. If you come from or have lived in certain third world countries for a specified (can't recall the exact amount) time, you are automatically disqualified as a donor. There are also other disqualifying factors like if you've had malaria like Honey said, or received a human growth hormone - but these are not unique to third world citizens.

Here are some of the restrictions on Europe that Carter Blood Care, one of the largest blood centers in the US, considers as permanent disqualifying factors.

• More than three months spent (cumulative) in the United Kingdom between 1980 and 1996.
• More than five years spent (cumulative) in Europe from 1980 to the present.
• If the donor was a member of the U.S. military, a civilian military employee, or a dependent of a member of the U.S. military who spent a total time of 6 months or more associated with a military base in any of the following countries: Belgium, the Netherlands, Germany between 1980 through 1990 or in Spain, Portugal, Turkey, Italy or Greece between 1980 – 1996.
• Recipients of blood transfusions in the U.K. since 1980.

These may be determined from an increased chance of having been exposed to certain pathogens not commonly available in the US. A person exposed to these would have antibodies that may harm a blood recipient who has never been exposed, and who in all likelihood is in an already weakened state, further compromising their health. So as convoluted as the restrictions may be, most have sound scientific principles behind them.

Mbeki is a very controversial figure. He's one of the few African leaders still clinging to traditional views over scientific evidence. The question on the existence of HIV is rhetorical. HIV/AIDS is relatively easy to diagnose, and once positively diagnosed, they usually encourage you to take the test again. Most of the people in third world countries newly infected are typically not as well informed as they should be. It’'s important to be open and honest with our problems so we can efficiently tackle them together.

Honey - How has Beijing's lack of statistics helped combat HIV/AIDS, and how would you know this seeing as there are no stats?

Gambian president
written by Nekessa , February 22, 2007

His claims are quite amazing. Imagine that!! I wonder what prompted him to begin his medical quest. Perhaps, like most of our leaders, he felt he was the solution to all the world's problems. How embarrassing!! Unless (gasp), he knows something we don't!!!

Thanks.
written by Bosibori , February 22, 2007

Honey-Thanks for correcting that,you got me worried for a while.

On the other hand,am a partial supporter of the Conspiracy theory/theories,but on the other hand I do believe that Africans need to take strategic steps towards reducing or eradicating this pandemic,but Africa cannot do it alone,Europe and America went through the same developmental stages where lives were lost through various other breakouts.Their development did not come solely.Trivial as it may seem ,the labour force and raw materials robbed from Africa provided for Economic prosperity that paved way for their Scientific research.In the same light the West owes a large sum of its input in assisting Africa towards sustainable growth instead of enriching a few western drug barons.

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written by Honey , February 22, 2007

I know Nekessa will get on my case for retorting that the poor of Africa need to do something about their lives, nevertheless I will say it.
Africa must seek its solutions. Poor Africans need to know that nobody cares out here, and help is not on its way.

AIDS is just a collection of opportunistic illnesses, how come it is uncontrollable in Africa? Because we tend to ignore the 'Gambian president' (he sounds alittle whacked) and other herbalists, even well known ones who are so cheap.
Instead of shooting down this man, why not try to find out what he is talking about (although being an African head of state, there is a chance he is hallucinating). others out there, why ignore them? Dont people in China study Herbal medicine? Dr. Kituyi, what did he study (not Acupuncture and other alternatives). Why does African have to be bad?

Whatever the origin of HIV, wether myth or real, it's effects are a big sore.

I still think even if a HIV cure was to be discovered today, now, Africans will still die of this mdudu. Why? Because we beg too much, and have refused to try on our own.

Simple plain example: (you probably have seen it elsewhere) every week end I watch malnourished Kenyans presented by world vision. Actually is is a rotation of African countries, from Kenya, SomaliA, Zambia.
Nauliza? one may be dirt poor, does it mean they are unable to blow their noses too? (literally). All the mucus streaming, and stinking rugs. One can thread bare clothes,whats wrong a little hygiene? All the streams in Africa, what is the water for?. The idea that when they look that terrible leads to more kwacha makes me believe: those who look like that have no desire to look better, and even if they were given a free ship with lottery winnings, they'd still head back to such a life.

No Honey, I mean Yes
written by Nekessa , February 22, 2007

Actually Honey, I am a proponent of Africa finding solutions for Africa. (I am not a conspiracy theorist is all). It's funny, but a few minutes ago, talking to my boss, he says that the Gambian pres might be onto something, but because he is constantly full of it, we might never know. Whats more, a lot of traditional herbal meds have been used to cure diseases in our communities for a long time.

Who begs in Africa? It certainly not the people, but the leaders. And what was supposed to be aid has become christmas gifts (well, not really, coz to get something from Santa you are supposed to be good). Take Kenya for example, and forget the do-no-gooders who sit on walls/pavements in downtown Nairobi or youth idling around in rural Kenya, but sit and watch the poor farmer, or the enterprising jua kali (wo)man, the Kenyans who hustle all day trying to make a living... no, they are not lazy, they are very hardworking.

On AIDS (the issue here)is not just poverty and leadership as I had mentioned, but also a reluctance in changing cultural practices.

About the flies, I cannot explain that one (shrug).

Recall
written by Honey , February 23, 2007

Anyone recall the Turkanas who successfully sued Britain for injuries due to landmines left behind by the British? They were probably hard workers in the Turkana, taking care of animals and doing their best in their way of life, then the windfall came.

They got millions. Very true. After about 5 years, they were all worse off than before the money?

What exactly ails Africa? Poverty is as a result of the people.

I do not hesitate quoting my rural backyard.

Caution!
written by Dave Nyambati , February 23, 2007

What saddens me is our continual holding of hands out to the west. I remember during the Moi days how angry Kenyans would get at the west for holding or withdrawing aid instead of resenting the politicians whose corrupt mismanagement created and widened most of the problems. Of course the colonialist share a lot of the blame but like Honey said, help is not on the way (at least not genuine help). Some of the problems we face today can be lessened if not solved by our own people, if a little ingenuity and a lot of determination was employed.

But we have to be careful not to blame all the victims for the conditions they may find themselves in. Honey, you'd be surprised how little attention you paid to your running nose when your belly is empty.

Herbal medicine is sometimes helpful, I know it's helped me in the past but again we have to be careful what we brand cures. I have a Zimbabwean friend who believes there is nothing that Aloe can't cure.

Death is inevitable.
written by Honey , February 27, 2007

Mr. Nyambati
It is a tough call.
I constantly disagree with fellow Kenyans who are so into asking for help to be sent to their villages. Yesterday one told me to watch my pride.
Human beings can think, but only if challenged to do so, only if they see the need to do so.

Allow me to tell a story of a young American who headed to rural Nyanza wanting to put up schools. He had $100, 000 to spend. But he learnt that so many villages needed help. So instead of spending the money, he asked for a meeting where he told the villagers his mission, and asked for their contribution. As Kenyans, they cited their lack of money. But he reminded them, acts lkike digging holes in the groung only needed time and young men.
Slowly, he used the very men to put up the school.

He left Kenya having put up 10 schools, simply by getting the locals to do something about it.